tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20975090.post8381808268961829564..comments2024-03-11T10:18:55.852-05:00Comments on Headius: The Future: Part OneCharles Oliver Nutterhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/06400331959739924670noreply@blogger.comBlogger20125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20975090.post-52829126585248436422009-09-30T00:51:40.988-05:002009-09-30T00:51:40.988-05:00Thanks for sharing such nice information on Java p...Thanks for sharing such nice information on Java platform. I am doing programming in Java and this information will be very useful to me. I like this information. It is also a very useful information for IT student. Well It is nice to post here. I like this site.omega-3http://www.vitabits.co.uk/oil/noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20975090.post-62674592151724872092009-07-16T13:07:34.194-05:002009-07-16T13:07:34.194-05:00You've neatly summed up my thoughts about the ...You've neatly summed up my thoughts about the future of Java. I've used (a little) Groovy, but I really miss the refactoring and code-completion comfort that only static types can give.<br /><br />Scala apparently has managed the unite the best of both type systems (dynamic and static types) and programming paradigms (OO and functional).Daniel Serodiohttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04702510073994831969noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20975090.post-58537090434546003772009-05-27T05:19:48.976-05:002009-05-27T05:19:48.976-05:00@Andrew: Scala 2.8 will support first-class delimi...@Andrew: Scala 2.8 will support first-class <A HREF="http://blog.richdougherty.com/2009/02/delimited-continuations-in-scala_24.html" REL="nofollow">delimited continuations</A>, thanks to a clever compile-time transformation. But it would be even better if the JVM support them natively, of course.Rich Doughertyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05537083862405028266noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20975090.post-82532329487274470462009-05-01T05:10:00.000-05:002009-05-01T05:10:00.000-05:00Good unbiased post and I think I probably agree wi...Good unbiased post and I think I probably agree with your conclusions re: scala.<br /><br />Personally, I prefer Scheme and have used SISC to build web applications on the JVM which is a breeze with SISCWeb but there is a performance hit. I notice that neither Scala or Clojure support first class continuations which is a real shame as I would consider them essential for any sensible web program. If the JVM platform could be extended to support native continuations and tail-call optimisation it would open it up to some great languages.Andrew Whaleyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05346078852977103014noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20975090.post-13637858987076983492009-04-24T23:04:00.000-05:002009-04-24T23:04:00.000-05:00James, I don't think JSR 192 is finished yet, and ...James, I don't think JSR 192 is finished yet, and invokedynamic isn't available in any JVMs is it? Actually, I was comparing it to the Strongtalk vm, what a shame that Sun didn't choose to finish it instead of having its authors work on Java.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20975090.post-36926372174822092212009-04-23T18:42:00.000-05:002009-04-23T18:42:00.000-05:00Great post. I find it very amusing, though, that ...Great post. I find it very amusing, though, that you neglected to mention JavaFX. That's my experience, too, but Sun obviously wouldn't agree, judging by the topics at the upcoming JavaOne conference. :)Unknownhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/18422425851786549424noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20975090.post-83469672567922446272009-04-22T20:02:00.000-05:002009-04-22T20:02:00.000-05:00Very nicely put Charles.Very nicely put Charles.ラファエルhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13468681593744741422noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20975090.post-64702681713371563542009-04-22T18:23:00.000-05:002009-04-22T18:23:00.000-05:00I really liked this post. We're using Lift/Scala a...I really liked this post. We're using Lift/Scala as the foundation for Innovation Games online, our serious games platform. I'm very pleased with the results. Of course, I'm biased, because my server team is Dan O'Leary (full-time) and David Pollak (half-time) and they're two of the most incredibly talented developers and architects I've ever known. We're looking forward to watching the growth of the games put a lot of great stress on Lift/Scala games. <br /><br />Regards,<br /><br />Luke Hohmann <br />CEO, Enthiosys, Inc. <br />615 National Ave, Ste 230 <br />Mountain View, CA 94087<br />m: +1-408-529-0319<br />lhohmann@enthiosys.com<br />www.innovationgames.com: The seriously fun way to do serious work -- seriously.Luke Hohmannhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07710702264941779336noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20975090.post-12110342008692939992009-04-22T17:23:00.000-05:002009-04-22T17:23:00.000-05:00Excellent post as always. This is clearly the way ...Excellent post as always. This is clearly the way Oracle should go. However, they should not abandon pure Java (not JVM) work, because there is a huge installed base, and I also still think that Java is still a good language. I still love to code in Java ;)<br /><br />@Philip Jenvey: <A HREF="http://incanusonrails.blogspot.com/2008/11/i-have-still-problem-with-dlr.html" REL="nofollow">What I saw of the DLR code some time ago did not convince me</A>. This could change I agree but for now I still need to be convinced ;)Hervehttp://incanusonrails.blogspot.comnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20975090.post-40710100632399361822009-04-22T16:21:00.000-05:002009-04-22T16:21:00.000-05:00Well anonymous, that article was from 2007 and the...Well anonymous, that article was from 2007 and the JVM has changed in the meantime. I believe the author of this blog is the main force behind that effort.James E. Ervin, IVhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08449037734048661986noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20975090.post-47615074851707508312009-04-22T16:00:00.000-05:002009-04-22T16:00:00.000-05:00The JVM is not a good fit for dynamic languages, a...The JVM is not a good fit for dynamic languages, although it could be changed. <br /><br />http://www.infoq.com/news/2007/05/java-dlrAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20975090.post-27208611137840672482009-04-22T15:39:00.000-05:002009-04-22T15:39:00.000-05:00I think you are right on. In fact, I think this t...I think you are right on. In fact, I think this transition has been in the works for a while or at least has been needed for a while. The Java platform includes the libraries, JVM and the languages built on top of it. Java as a language is beyond mature, in fact the mess of generics (though I love them in the simplest use cases like collections) shows that Java 5.0 should have been another language entirely, leaving Java 1.4 as the conclusion.<br /><br />The success of the platform recently has been the fact that it has enabled development of frameworks and languages on top of it. This trend should continue and be pushed harder. The technical merits of that path are obvious.<br /><br />Still, I think that it would be more useful for someone to make a stronger business case for this path. What I mean is, on the one hand, Sun's stewardship of the Java platform has been good, but other companies make far more money than Sun does off of it. This is not only *unfair* but I think unsustainable. Companies and organizations that derive business value (read cash,scratch,moola,dead presidents) from the Java technology should be the ones also devoting resources to improving Java. Of course, this is a common problem, I know Eclipse for one has it too and maybe more so. The point is how we might be able to correctly point the economic incentives in a way that helps focus resources down the path we would like to see Java go. <br /><br />Btw, I have no idea how to accomplish this. :)James E. Ervin, IVhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08449037734048661986noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20975090.post-1975456459359628202009-04-22T14:48:00.000-05:002009-04-22T14:48:00.000-05:00The JVM has come a long way in becoming a multi-la...The JVM has come a long way in becoming a multi-language platform. Unfortunately Microsoft's .NET is still a little bit ahead here. They started earlier and fund many more .NET language related developers.<br /><br />I mean, <A HREF="http://blogs.sun.com/jrose/entry/bravo_for_the_dynamic_runtime" REL="nofollow">the .NET DLR work excites John Rose</A>. It excites me too, and I hate Microsoft as much as anyone could. This is kind of a sad situation: the JVM, with so much potential in this area, playing catch up to the CLR. Meanwhile a key player like Charlie is reduced to almost groveling for more resources.Philip Jenveyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17437958274873977298noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20975090.post-49500774463137078802009-04-22T09:32:00.000-05:002009-04-22T09:32:00.000-05:00Will the Language Czar have to face scrutiny regar...Will the Language Czar have to face scrutiny regarding whether or not they paid their taxes? If so, there's, unfortunately, little hope in the position being filled.Unknownhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09582587198365370386noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20975090.post-74573250140446531122009-04-22T09:24:00.000-05:002009-04-22T09:24:00.000-05:00@Charles - I'm very curious about the czar thing. ...@Charles - I'm very curious about the czar thing. Even relatively homogenous projects with a well recognized leader like the Linux kernel project are just shy of rampant anarchy. How can a language czar have any real influence across multiple communities with different goals?James Iryhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02835376424060382389noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20975090.post-19936572704344645432009-04-22T09:21:00.000-05:002009-04-22T09:21:00.000-05:00I enjoyed reading this, thanks for posting. Looki...I enjoyed reading this, thanks for posting. Looking forward to more posts on the future of the JVM.Alex Kanehttp://www.alexkane.netnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20975090.post-87721374279527769672009-04-22T09:07:00.000-05:002009-04-22T09:07:00.000-05:00I guess I commented too fast. You did mention clo...I guess I commented too fast. You did mention clojure. Lots of people like Clojure, including myself (just as much as I like JRuby) and there's lots going on in the community.dysingerhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13310783563646722381noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20975090.post-77270301379654625322009-04-22T08:58:00.000-05:002009-04-22T08:58:00.000-05:00You forgot Clojure. There are folks doing clojure...You forgot Clojure. There are folks doing clojure in production and it surpases Scala on github.com for repositories. It's a close second behind Scala on wefollow.com.dysingerhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13310783563646722381noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20975090.post-40342930305895254882009-04-22T07:57:00.000-05:002009-04-22T07:57:00.000-05:00Great post. I for one, play in the static language...Great post. I for one, play in the static languages league and would love to see something like Scala taking the baton from Java (especially since the evolution of Java hits brick walls like we see once again in Java 7 - no hope for closures, reified generics, properties etc.) I've been learning JavaFX even not being a GUI guy, just for the sheer pleasure of using a languge that keeps what I love from Java but adds type inference and other modern traits like some support for FP. And I echo your words on Scala's complexity - the language is already a little hard for less experienced developers, I hope they don't go the way of Haskell which was a hugely promising language but became a playground of PhDs in post-modern typesystems and completely died as a viable mainstream language (wonder if Haskell' has any chance to revert that).<br /><br />I hope Oracle understand the enormous value of what you and other alternative-JVM-languages hackers have been doing. Ditto for other major players, IBM for example seems to be supporting Groovy as one of their "sMash" languages; Google is also being very helpful to make several languages work in their AppEngine for Java.Osvaldo Doederleinhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05264918260779798314noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20975090.post-69655928807572580382009-04-22T07:05:00.000-05:002009-04-22T07:05:00.000-05:00good review of the actual situation and trends of ...good review of the actual situation and trends of JVM although i am a clojure fan and would it on top of the JVM realm :-PAnonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03081252416288495482noreply@blogger.com